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 Desk of Patents and Innovations

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Lenyo
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:12 am

17,404 is too small a sample? I don't know what stats class you took, but that's WAY higher than what you usually get. And as for confounding variables, this previous study controlled for parents' economic status.

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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:56 pm

"Straus and colleagues in 32 nations used data on corporal punishment experienced by 17,404 university students when they were children."

17,000 is too small a sample when taking in sources from 32 countries on four continents. The varying cultures and societal values as well as what constitutes "beatings" in those countries is a significant factor. Additionally, the study looked only at university students which, and I don't need to explain why, has issues on its own.

I read through that previous study you linked and it looks pretty solid. The only issues I have with it being an apparently blatant author bias (which can be forgiven), the use of data in which mixed in "children" beaten with teenagers beaten (over half of all responses concerning teenagers), and the self-professed issues with not separating supportive/loving corporal punishment parents with non-supportive corporal punishment parents.

Still, the data clearly supports what you were trying to say, though I might disagree on the exact significance numbers. I never said I cared if you patented it, but in case there was any confusion I retract any expressed or implied objections to your patent.

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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:32 pm

Nah, you're just bringing up something I instinctively didn't want to consider: that there probably isn't nearly as much of an A causes B relationship as I want there to be. I still believe the hypothesis, but this is hardly as watertight as - say - smoking causes mouth cancer. So I rescind my application. I might resubmit it in 30 RL years in the unlikely event we're all still here.

(I will still continue to believe that my imaginary people are slightly smarter than your imaginary peoples, though. Who said commies can't be nationalist? Answer: Straw Man.)

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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Wed Aug 22, 2012 11:32 pm

This thread has gotten a bit messy. I think I might delete a lot of this conversation and make a separate thread for discussion of inventions.

If anyone has any requests, including ones that Olivarcy has not gotten back to you about. Please resubmit them in full so I can review.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:15 pm

Lenyo wrote:
Hmm... I'd like the B61-11. Wiki page below. It's pretty much a bunker-buster nuke.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B61-11

While I'm at it, would anyone mind if I claimed the Dong Feng 21? Cuz' it's really cool.
I hope that's not too informal.

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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:04 pm

No, that is fine Lenyo.

About the B61-11, I'm going to make the same judgement that Oscal made about my request for thermobaric weaponry.

The Mod 11 version of the B61 guided bomb (the thing to which you refer) is too broad to be patented. All it really is (ignoring guidance systems) is a 40 year old nuclear bomb design with a depleted uranium tip. That being said, there are facets of it you could patent, for instance the ability to "dial-a-yield" is a technique probably only the most advanced nuclear programs would be capable of (something that the B61 mod 11 can do).

Other than that though, I can't really forbid other countries from just putting their already-existing uranium tips on their already-existing nuclear stockpiles.

The Dong Feng 21 is more complicated. It's exact capabilities are still not fully known, but it is clearly a very credible threat (as the U.S. reaction to it proves). I will approve it, but on two conditions. One is that Lenyo partners with a cyber-tech power to produce the complex missile guidance system necessary for the project and the other is that you RP the launching of the guidance satellites.

The Dong Feng missiles are so dangerous because they can adjust mid-course to hit moving targets from hundreds of miles away and have the guidance systems to radically alter their course headings (making them difficult to shoot down). While they are not exactly impervious to flak shield systems, they are cheap to produce per missile. Cheap enough that each target can be assigned multiple redundant warheads.

The capabilities gained here are essentially doing away with the necessity of heavy naval spending in terms of ship to ship conflict as no surface navy can approach your missile range without being torn to shreds. The trade-off is that such a guidance system is invariably tied to the function of its guidance satellites. They are the weak point in your arsenal. If they go down, your missile shield goes down. If you are ok with this and the other two terms I mentioned then I'll add it to the list. Let me know
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:43 pm

A fine CoSP response. I agree to all conditions. Such a project needs RPed steps.

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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Sat Dec 22, 2012 7:31 am

Wow, Fid has been a fine SoC while I was away, wasn't he? Pretty epic response to the request.

I need to fix this place as well... and... remove patent rights on countries that don't exist... I should make a ruling saying that the countries that went away and returned has to SHARE their patent rights if another country has RPed it for their own.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Sat Dec 22, 2012 3:36 pm

that sounds good to me
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:59 am

Speaking of sounding good...

Fid, did we EVER come into agreement with Railgun? I remember you saying that you wanted rapid fire gun and I said "erm... no," but I don't recall what was the final agreement.

I still say that rapid fire is an overkill, but there may be a source now where it says it is possible? If not... I imagine railgun to be an epic-win nonetheless, and that it deserves an OMC-val as well as patent. While I won't make you have development RP post (you probably could've made plenty of time if I stuck around, so I'll take responsibility for this), I would say that you will need to slowly integrate into the RP, like how I done with thermal laser, where I first started with lower concentration prototype and worked up to mobile platforms.

Your input? I dunno what you said, so I am counting on you to remember ^^.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:48 am

well the u.s. has 32 MJ railguns that can fire at over 10 rounds per minute. they are currently attempting to build prototypes of a64 MJ weapon that can fire at least once every six seconds. other types of designs such as 7MJ bunker/tank buster railings already exist, though not yet in mass production. given that a round with 32 MJ hits with nearly the same force as a tomahawk cruise missile. and most modern ship designs can't support a64 MJ sized gun assembly I'm happy using the smaller weapons if they can sport the 10 rounds per minute firing rate. I'll phase them in by retro fitting my fleet of zumwalt- class destroyers if that sounds good to you. I can also give you some links if you need help figuring a omc Val.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:03 am

Hmmm... I would say that OMC-val would be around the same as thermal laser. And the "force" means the piercing power, not the explosive power, right? I have hard time believing that a projectile would have that much "umph" as a missile.

As for 10 rounds per min... could you... erm... RP that? That sounds too strong for me to give it to you all in one go. Your project is approved, but could you spread it out, starting with 1 round per min and working your way up?

And... just how wide-spread would your railgun be? Like is it already implemented in all your zumwalt destroyers? Or is it in certain ones while not on others?

Oh and speaking of zumwalt... you said that they were stealth treated, right?




Hmmm..... ... ... ...

...........

I have a proposal for you: since it is obvious that you want both for your special "superweapon," why don't you RP a development of zumwalt-class destroyer itself? I will approve both railgun (whole thing... one with 10 per min reload) and stealth, but you just need to RP its development in the National subforum. That way you have legitimacy and I don't need to headache over whether it is fair for me to approve such a weapon.


Wait... so 7MJ bunkerbuster exists? Huh... to think that railguns were a sci-fi weapon in the past... but then again, Oscal has army of robotic drones, so I shouldn't be the one trying to test the reality of all this. And... isn't 1 every 6 sec same as 10 every min? 60 seconds in a minute, so 60/10 is 1 every 6 sec for 32MJ, right? ^^
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Sun Dec 23, 2012 4:03 pm

Okay, well for a bit of explanation. One megajoule is equal to the energy of a one-ton car going 100 miles an hour. So a 32 MJ cannon is obviously, 32 times that force. The 100 pound projectiles are thrown at a speed of about mach-8. They are moving fast enough that not only do you never hear it coming. But with reasonable assumptions about sea level and deck height. IF you were on a ship that was shot at by one of these rounds. If you were staring directly at the point on the horizon where the round is coming from on a clear day, you would only have about 30 seconds to get your ass off the ship before it hit. Because the weapon can close distance from the horizon that fast, evasive maneuvers are near impossible and radar is not an effective defense. Since as I'm sure you know. radar can only monitor as far as the horizon.

The force imparted is kinetic force. If you could swing a strong enough baseball bat hard enough, you could sink a carrier. It's all about energy imparted. True a projectile going that speed would likely go straight through whatever it hit, limiting how much Kinetic force was imparted but aside from having to rip through several dozen steel walls on the inside of the naval ship, the round also pierces the thick outer hull. SO there is a lot of force that the ship goes out of its way to absorb from the round (which makes the hardened design of metal warships work in favor of this new technology). In addition to the sheer force line created by the round, the ship would also experience the equivalent of "arterial shock". Arterial shock is the damage done to blood vessels by a bullet passing through because of the shockwave the bullet makes in the surrounding tissue. It is why a high caliber round to a non-lethal area on the body can still kill you. It rips your internals apart. The railgun round would work the same way. imagine you are standing in a hallway in your destroyer on your way to you rack since your shift is over. SUddenly, 200 feet down the hall something moving 6 times the speed of sound goes flying by. If the sudden and violent vacuum, and heat, and shrapnel doesnt tear/melt/cut you, the sound alone would permanently deafen you. These rounds, even if they don't physically sink a ship (which they most certainly should) would render entire sectors of the ship into melted/ravaged/crewless wastelands.

The U.S. Office of Naval Research (ONR) has publicly stated that these railguns are being designed to replace the expensive tomahawk cruise missiles, and to phase out of guided missile destroyers as the sole offensive naval power (given the prevalence of jamming and counter-missile technologies). The navy's 32MJ railgun can fire over 100 miles with lethal force (to ships) at a range almost 4 times current ship-to-ship munitions are capable of. The 64MJ design would be able to fire nearly 300 miles. They are weapons designed for coastal bombardment from a safe distance, area denial, and anti-carrier and destroyer warfare.

Everything I've said so far is factual based on technologies we (the real world) already have.

Now moving on to your questions/suggestions. I think only a portion of my destroyers were intended to have railguns, I have all the info saved in my military facts section. I think I own 20-30 destroyers intended for the upgrade.

ZUmwalt-class detroyers were never built because congress backed out at the last second. but they were designed with an "advanced gun system" which was just a large artillery piece in the middle of the ship that fired regular munitions to fill the void until the whole thing could be ripped out and replaced by railguns which the navy was already working on when the design was made. SO these things are, by design, ready to take the upgrade. I allotted I think 100-200 million dollars per ship to make the upgrade/build the weapon when I did my budget.

ZUmwalt class destroyers do have a low radar profile, that is true. But its because of their special design. Half of the ship sits underwater. It looks like this:
http://static.progressivemediagroup.com/uploads/imagelibrary/2-zumwalt-class-design.jpg
http://www.popsci.com/files/imagecache/article_image_large/articles/PSC1012_ZD_043.jpg

I never intended for them to be stealth. The discussion we had before was about whether or not I could have stealth nuclear and attack submarines. Which you said "no" to.

Anyways how about a compromise: Even if such a ship had stealth tech. The moment that gun fired every single type of detection instrument would go off either from the sound, heat, electromagnetic shockwave, of the giant-ass trail of fire that follows the round. So no, the ships cannot be stealth. Additionally, My ships are only capable of firing 3 times per minute to start (once every twenty seconds) But, during firing barrages the water-cooled system creates a large cloud of steam that makes them very visible. The max capability of the weapon can be 6 rounds per minute (once every ten seconds) but I would need a partnership with one of the tech nations in our region to upgrade the design.

Also I will roleplay the outfitting of the fleet in the international section. This way the destroyers will be transparent internationally, limited in number, non-stealth, with a fire rate half of what i suggested, a weakness in their design, and needing foreign aid to finalize their full potential. Does this sound good?

I was never looking for a superweapon. I just really wanted a railgun. And to have a navy that could hold its own despite its smaller size.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:53 am

Well, having a gun with a power to shred through normal destroyers once every 20 seconds would be gamechanger in the RP, which would give OMC-val. Low numeric OMC-val, but OMC nonetheless. I suppose OMC doesn't necessarily superweapon, but still, it is basically a special feature of Fid, much like thermal laser is to Oscal.

I'll bite. Eventually you can probably also have one that goes 10 rounds per min as well. As long as you RP it, railgun shouldn't be a problem in the first place. I just didn't like the whole... machinegun-like railgun trying to own everything in range.



I wonder if programmed thermal laser network can nullify railgun... I should start researching on it. Oscal is probably the only tech-country that you could use... and I'm willing as long as you help me out with nuclear power plants ^^
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:52 am

Alright... I made the request go official for railgun tech.

Btw, about the Heavy Water reactors... did you still want that approved?

And... I realized recently that since now the process of patent approval is more linear (I just need to approve it... without voting...), I wonder how I would approve my own patents. Do I just say yes to my own weapons? Hmmmm...
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:45 pm

Yes please I would still like my advanced heavy water reactors. I think for your own technologies we should talk about it briefly before you just go ahead and approve your own death star.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:01 pm

My own death star? I would very much want ^^

I read the articles, and since there is a power plant under construction with the expected date of finish, I would consider this modern technology. So it is basically stable nuclear power plant with minimal possible meltdowns and far better efficiency, right?


Speaking of power plants... Damn it!! I am so close, yet still too far for me to use. I will eventually get that fusion plant working in my country... of course, that would mean that I would need to get started on nuclear tech legacy for my nation soon... either way, I hope that one of these days I can get one of these bad boys working for my electric needs... until then... fuel cell tech would do the trick.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:06 pm

Better efficiency, cheaper fuel, safer, and uses thorium instead of uranium. Meltdowns in the way we think of them are impossible however, they only produce about 40 percent of a normal power plant's output.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:07 pm

I love the efficiency part...

anyways, I'll be updating it once I get the chance. It is approved for now... as I said before, I am really most interested in making sure that it is modern of all things... that and weapons... I am sensitive with weapons.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:21 pm

Quote :
Oscal is probably the only tech-country that you could use... and I'm willing as long as you help me out with nuclear power plants ^^
Unless KI returns

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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Wed Dec 26, 2012 8:36 am

KI is indeed second tech-based country, but compared to my IT legacy, he pales in comparison... only thing he has to his name is his excessive spending and his OOC claim that he is leader of electronic industry ^^
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:01 pm

I would like to patent development and cutting-edge work being done in Fdieliara on anti-drone solid state laser technology. First field tested for the media in 2010 the design has come a long way since then with German engineering company Rheinmetall Defence proved the weapon's viability by using a laser array to shoot down two drones moving 50 meters per second at a distance of over a mile. In the test the laser array was also used to shoot a mortar round out of the air.

It appears that for land use, this technology is almost ready. However at its present size and energy draw it is only useful as an emplaced weapon. Rheinmetall is working on a smaller version to be used on mobile transports for troop defense. While the technology has not yet been perfected, back in 2010 US company Raytheon admitted to having successfully tested and shot down multiple drones in a maritime environment at the U.S. Navy's testing range under realistic combat conditions.

Raytheon is presently working on incorperating the laser system into the CIWS system already standard on U.S. ships. A system which Fideliara already uses.

Clearly these won't be standard right off the bat. We are working on practical uses for them at sea though, since Fideliara focuses on naval technology first. We may use them at SBANDS locations as well and for general air defense on military bases. This will be a technology open for collaboration and sale at my nation's discretion.

Links are here:

Old 2010 test

Recent Test

Recent Test info (not by BBC)

I can provide more info and links if necessary.
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:16 am

Erm... I am really sorry to disappoint, but this is basically thermal laser. I used the similar page to the link you have in the 2010 test ([My thermal laser news article]) along with Wiki article to ask Isis for thermal laser. Basically mine does the same thing... missile defense and anti-aircraft. Oscal had them for years.

I suppose it isn't off-limits, but due to the nature of Desk of Patents and Innovations, I can only patent invention and or innovation that hasn't already been patented. Oscal currently holds licence for it, so... you would have to go through in-game RPing to get their technology to your country.


Oscal's use is also mostly for establishing similar network to your... SBANDS?... that is called "Thermal Network," which basically is complex computer-based automated defensive system that prevents most air and missiles from entering a particular zone. Thermal Network has been shown off to ward off KI's best Aces in actual warfare, and it has been successful in Rasvidi retracting his missile threat to some random country. Thermal Network also exists in Encrypted Cities to ward off ICBMS and other missile systems as well as enemy aircrafts from coming too close. Encrypted Cities' Thermal Network is sophisticated enough that it can heat certain area of the tungsten rounds to disrupt the projectiles' target for Kinetic Bombardment Stations.

In navy, Oscal has two ships that has the thermal laser: Rckwd class Thermal Boat (Patrol boat but instead of guns thermal laser) and GngBng class UCSVS carrier. Oscal has two versions of thermal laser at the moment, with third in conception: E-Optics I (smaller, fuel-conservative variant for use in Thermal Boats and small defensive platforms) and E-Optics II (stronger but more fuel-costly variant for use in Encrypted Cities and other major installations. UCSVS carriers also use this).
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:41 pm

So I really don't know what a thermal laser is. I've never wanted to call you out on it, but that is not the name of any operational laser system. The Lasers I want to use are Solid State Lasers. More on them here

The technology was not even under field tests when you were awarded it. Even the technology today cannot shoot down planes as you described them. And they are not yet viable as a full on missile shield as you have claimed. If the former members approved your patent that was just as impossible then as it is three years later, that is between you and them.

If only one country is allowed to have "lasers" that is fine. I'll move my R&D budget to other things. Maybe I'll try researching "guns."
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PostSubject: Re: Desk of Patents and Innovations   Thu Jan 10, 2013 6:33 pm

Each SoC has different intrepretation of "modern" technology. I wasn't SoC then, and when I asked, he was aware of the innovation and thought that it was inventable within the next 5 years RL time, which was his definition of "modern" technology.

I am... aware of the name of solid state laser. Just decided that thermal laser was a better sounding word for it. Although I am aware of its misnomer.

Hmmm... the whole laser idea was fun to me at that time, and there were certain examples like Boeing creating an airbourn laser that can destroy jets and such... so I never truly did much experiment with it. The only problem for me to retract Isis's old Patent would be that it has been integrated so much into my nation that I will have problem as an RPer... but maybe I should look into it. The only justification would be that E-Optics systems has been getting a whole lot more attention and funding, as well as "years" of RP-time research. But that really isn't something that I like to say to justify my laser grids.
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